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GBM6212H-150T vs PM6010
  • Moonlight
    So I am finally ready to jump in and start building a gimbal. I have mostly everything figured out as except choosing between these 2 motors.

    I need help confirming my suspicions.
    GBM6212: http://www.iflight-rc.com/ipower-motor-gbm6212h-150t-brushless-gimbal-motor-with-as5048a-encoder.html
    PM6010: http://brushlessgimbal.ca/BRUSHLESS-GIMBAL-PTZ/Gimbal-Brushless-Motor/BGC-Encoder-Motor-PM6010-AS5048A-Encoder-Built-Inside

    According to the respective product pages, I have determined the following facts.
    Both:
    Built-in encoders
    hollow shaft - support for slip ring
    weight 247g
    SPI, I2C, or PWM for encoder communication

    GBM6212:
    150 turns
    15.2ohms resistance
    Torque of 1200-2800g (-cm?) (@ 11v )
    rated for 11.1V

    PM6010:
    90 turns
    12 ohms resistance
    Torque of 800mN-m (converted to 8157g-cm) @14.8v
    Suitable for camera up to 4000g


    So my confusion is according to the listed specs, the PM6010 is a much more powerful motor for the same price. Is this correct? I feel like I am missing something here.

    As a side note, I was planning on powering everything off a sony np-f battery, which operates at about 7 volts. The product page on the 32bit extended says it operates from 8v to 26v. Will the sony be enough, or will I need 2? I was looking at the levitezer blog (http://levitezer.com/styled-2/blog-2/files/72d28d8da53e386944cd0f0b42a017b6-29.html) and I thought the test gimbal was being powered by an np-f.

    I have not used the simpleBGC before, so I don't know how it handles power management in regards to it's self and the motors. I have found it difficult to find any decent hardware build guides that talk about the electrical distribution side of things. My question in regards to the motors and battery is do I lose any power by only using one 7v with the PM6010, or would using 2 for 14v with the GBM6212 give it more power?

    Hope someone can shed some light here, this is still pretty new to me.
    PS: I want stronger motors because I use heavier cameras, and these are the 2 best ones I have found for sub $100.
  • AOPEN3434AOPEN3434
    simpe answer it does not matter! both motors will handle up to 10lb+ you may wan to look a new encoder motor with BGC controller built inside the motor !
    http://brushlessgimbal.ca/BRUSHLESS-GIMBAL-PTZ/Gimbal-Brushless-Motor/BGC-Encoder-Motor-DM40-130T-With-Slip-Ring-1-BGC-Controller11
  • znelson
    To the OP, we need to know more about your project to help you size the motors. Can you describe the largest camera package that you intend to use? Oran (AOPEN) likes to just recommend parts from his website without really understanding your project.

    My first recommendation would be to work directly with manufacturers of your parts. Don't buy via brushlessgimbal.ca because they do not actually manufacture anything and only regurgitate specs from other websites. They are really good kits available for handheld use from Famoushobby. I would recommend you look at this kit below and contact them directly about pricing. Confirm that you need the SimpleBGC w/ Encoders board, slipring on YAW axis and 4S batteries.

    http://www.famoushobby.com/kit-bg003pro-famoushobby-dslr-3axis-brushless-gimbal-kitcanon-5d-handle-camera-gimbal-dslrcamera-mount-camera-steablizerhan-p-577.html

    To answer your questions about power management (you'll notice Oran doesn't answer these questions), SimpleBGC has an allowable power input voltage range. If you input 12v, the motors will be supplied with ~12v. If you input 24v the motors will be supplied with ~24v. Does that make sense?

    For example- if you took two identical gimbals with the same hardware/motors and correct tuning, gimbal "A" with 12v with produce half the torque of gimbal "B" with 24v. This is assuming you have the power set to 100% on both system. There are options in the software to reduce the power (current/amps) if it's not needed.

    There is a little more to, but that gets into PWM and duty cycle.

    Encoders are required for higher torque applications, because motor power (current/amps) will only be applied to the motor proportionally to the disturbance. This is very important because it reduces/eliminates unnecessary current going to the motors which results in overheating.

    Garug is a very good resource for information. I am also happy to help however I can. Send me a DM if you need anything.
  • AOPEN3434AOPEN3434
    Zachary Nelson thanks for the business for http://www.famoushobby.com!
    I get payed either way thanks. WHY I AM I ANSWERING QUESTIONS THAT YOU SHOULD KNOW IF YOU RED THE MANUAL?
  • Moonlight
    Thank you for the responses from both of you. I'm sorry it took me until now to reply. Here is a little more information:

    I plan on making my own frame for the whole gimbal, so I don't want to buy a "pre-made kit." (To me that kind of defeats the purpose of DIY).
    The point of asking about the motors was more of trying to figure out the best value between the 2. aka: price to torque value. Both are $80 but PM6010 "appears" to have more torque 'If the listed specs are correct and I have understood them correctly!' I know that both are very strong motors for my current setup (a canon dslr), but I am hoping in the future to upgrade to a bigger setup with my diy follow focus system and what not. I am a long way away from that, but I am still hoping the upgrade path will be there. So basically, I figure if I am going to spend the same $80 on motors, I might as well get the more powerful of the 2, but I am just unable to verify if the information I've found and calculated is correct.

    The info on how power is supplied to the motors is very helpful. If the power to torque curve was linear, then I believe that the GBM6212 would have a torque closer to 3700g-cm.

    At first, the thought of the controller being built into the yaw motor from the link posted by Oran sounded compelling, but I think it would overall make it harder to replace parts if I needed to. I think I will probably end up with this 'kit' here, just because if the cost efficiency:
    http://www.iflight-rc.com/alexmos-32-bit-bgc-with-gbm6208h-200t-encoder-system-combo-set.html

    PS: motivations for this undertaking. I own a DJI Ronin-M. For as nice as it is, it has quite a few quirks. I am ultimately looking to replace it with my own DIY version where I will address the problems I've had with it's frame. I like the ronin, but it is not modder friendly in the slightest, and I am a maker at heart.

    My plan is to make a frame that is more modular. Something that is easy to add or take away pieces as needed, and is also easy to adjust for fine tuning balance. That has been my biggest complaint with the ronin. It's not easy to make fine adjustments. That and it's size, My frame will be overall smaller to start with, but since it will be modular, I will be able to increase it's size as needed for a particular setup. If all goes well, I will likely sell my ronin, though possibly not because I would be taking a huge loss on it. (Like an idiot I bought it pretty quickly after it came out, and it's value is now less than half of what I got it for...)

    Anyway rant over. I am of course open to more suggestions. Any thoughts on all this?
  • Wieger
    Hello Moonlight, as you I'm a DIY guy, I already built a 1200mm pixhawk quad and stil trying to finalize my gimbal setup, I bouth all motors and basecam board from iflight-rc.com I just jumped in the water with them because as you say there isn't too much info in the web regarding hardware guides for gimbals, It's always a guessing.

    I think the torque specs on website refers of weight of camera they can handle, not gm-c, so 6012 will have a slight more power than a 6010, I bought:

    2x 6012 for pitch and roll, both with encoders, 1 with slipring
    http://www.iflight-rc.com/ipower-motor-gbm6212h-150t-brushless-gimbal-motor-with-as5048a-encoder.html

    1x8108 for yaw, with encoder and slipring
    http://www.iflight-rc.com/ipower-motor-gbm8108-90t-brushless-gimbal-motor-with-as5048a-encoder-compatible-with-slipring-424.html

    A basecam original board with encoder firmware
    http://www.iflight-rc.com/basecam-simplebgc-32-bit-extended-gimbal-controller-encoder-version.html

    Before I bought everything I had several questions that I ended up answering one way or another, so to save you some time:
    1. Yes, you can install slipring and encoder at the same time, the encoder aluminum case has some milimeters between the encoder chip and a magnet ring so cables can go on the side and get out of the case, just you have to be carefull when you align the encoder case so don't damage cables, first when I ordered from iflight I didn't know this, in their website it isn't so clear if you are buying the slipring encoder version or the encoder version, difference is in the type of magnet and magnet mount, these guys saw my order and before charge me or ship they contacted (about 12 hrs answer) me and asked what I was tying to accomplished (WOW for customer service, I have never been contacted from a US company asking me if I was shure of my order), so I ended up buying all motors slipring encoder compatible but only 2 sliprings (they asked me to install the sliprings for me before shipping).

    2. Regarding the board, It's a basecam licensed manufacturer so board came with a registered license and you can upgrade in the GUI to any encoder future encoder versions, and you skip the $40 encoder license from basecam, solders are allright, some connectors maybe a little out of alignment but everything works and I saved some bucks, they only have I2C IMU version.

    3. Motor power is enough for my setup at 3s, I'm using GH5+metabones+laowa 12mm about 1505 grs, 140mm total lenght and power setup goes this way (255 is full power, i.e. using 12V then 100/255*12= 4.70V ):
    PITCH
    Minimum 70, less than 70 camera will oscillate pitch continuous.
    Best 150, between 100-140 if move the camera with my hands it cogs a little when returning to neutral, actually isn't cogging but motor power isn't quite enough to keep a steady movement, so it won't be smooth footage when returning after a violent move. So that means PITCH will use only 55% of available power, with a longer lens i.e. sigma 18-35 810 grs about 12mm an increase to 1710 grs total 180 mm setup power needs to be set at 250 if I want a complete steady movement if I throw camera pitch with my hands (i think this movement is too violent even using it on a quad but just to be shure). So, with this lens to be shure I think I should put a 4s instead of a 3s battery.

    ROLL
    It's smooth at 110 power so, maybe a 5208 will work who knows, my roll bar is 325mm long

    YAW
    I haven't setup yet, I still have to fabricate a dampening method to adapt yaw to the quad i thinking thick foam and a coil of steel wire, first try without foam was too jumpy, didn't work.

    Well I hope this solve your inquiry, I will finalize and try it on my quad and see how it behaves, good luck buddy!
  • AOPEN3434AOPEN3434
    Hello for a copter you have made some bad choices BG5208 motors are good for payload up to 10lb at 14v- 22v no issues and are lighter than 6010 & 6012! ^your reducing your flight time with heavier gear than you need ! iflight encoder motors are not designed for slip ring & encoders you need to use a ring magnet to relapse magnet that come with encoder kit! suggest you look at BGC encoder motor designed for slip ring and encoder like PM5208 PM4804 or DM50/DM70 motors ! Yaw axis is always the week point BG5208 you can go larger motor on YAW!
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